A couple of weeks ago, just moments after delivering a career-spanning masterclass at the Thessaloniki Film Festival, Catherine George sat down to talk to us on a balcony overlooking Aristotle Square—a pedestrianized area that sits at the end of a grand promenade that connects the city’s ancient Agora to the Aegean sea. Since moving from Northern Ireland to America in the early 2000s, George has become a trusted costume designer to some of the most idiosyncratic filmmakers of that period, including Lynne Ramsay, Jim Jarmusch, and Bong Joon Ho—the latter of whom approached her after seeing We Need to Talk About Kevin in Cannes and has since collaborated with her on Snowpiercer, Okja, and Mickey 17. It was November 1st, the morning after Halloween. I was curious if all that work had inspired a costume or two.
“There were some Mickeys this year,” George explains, in her Northern lilt, “but actually, I did a film called Problemista where Tilda [Swinton] plays this character with red hair. She’s like an old, rock-and-roll dragon. A lot of people in New York dressed up as her!” George grew up in Belfast in the turbulent 1980s and cites the style of that era, particularly Vivienne Westwood, as an enduring influence. In the 1970s, her older brother Terry moved to New York and wrote a play at the Irish Arts Centre, which led to him co-writing In the Name of the Father with Jim Sheridan—a script that earned them both nominations at the Oscars. George got a start working on Sheridan’s 1997 film The Boxer before immersing herself in the thriving American independent scene: “I was brought in as a wardrobe supervisor on Coffee and Cigarettes,” she explains of her first brush with Jarmusch, “Cate Blanchett’s character, she meets her cousin, who’s sort of punk. So I went around to all my mates and borrowed clothes. She ended up wearing my friend‘s leather jacket, my trousers, a T-shirt from another friend. I was so in awe of Jim [Jarmusch] that I kind of geeked out when it came to actually talking to him.”
These days, George and Jarmusch are regular collaborators and friends, having worked together on Paterson, The Dead Don’t Die, and his recent Golden Lion winner, Father Mother Sister Brother. That film has capped a landmark year for the costume designer, after Bong’s Mickey 17 premiered in Berlin and Ramsay’s Die My Love went to Cannes. We took the conversation, which has been edited and condensed for clarity, from there.
The Film Stage: During the masterclass, you talked about being quite cautious with color when you started out. Was working with Lynne Ramsay on We Need to Talk About Kevin a turning point for you?
Catherine George: Definitely, with Lynne, Tilda, and all the reds in that film, it was really nice to embrace all that. You know, Lynne is so literal and visceral. Tilda’s character goes through this traumatic experience, but you don’t know if it’s true. She’s telling it from her own perspective. You’re imagining she’s putting her own spin on it.
Was it quite liberating, creatively, the experience of working on that film?
It was amazing. People always ask, “Oh, that must have been a tough shoot.” It was actually one of the funnest shoots we’ve had. We all stayed in Connecticut and would hang out and occasionally have sing-alongs in the evenings. John C. Reilly is a great singer and guitarist and Lynne loves to sing. So the combination of that team was really something special. It was the first time I’d worked with Tilda and we just hit it off immediately.
You use a lot of floral print in Die My Love. Was that part of the conversation with Lynne? It seems to tie in with Lawrence’s character. We get these incredible moments where she’s prowling around in the grass.
We talked more about the colors, because the film was being shot on Ektachrome, which is a very old film stock. It’s a reversal film, used for its vibrancy, and has a unique look. So we all embraced that and went for saturated colors. Jennifer’s character, Grace, is having a breakdown, and her clothes kind of reflect that. It’s a mix of something that shouldn’t really be together. At one point [Robert’s character] wears her dressing gown, a floral robe, and he’s wearing it with her sports shorts and flip-flops. Then, at other times, she wears his shirts.
Ramsay is such a fascinating filmmaker. She’s like this genius who just shows up once a decade, usually with something you’ve never seen before, then just seems like the most normal person in interviews. Do you keep in touch?
We’ve become pals. I mean, it happens with a few people that I’ve worked with on multiple projects. Lynne, Director Bong, Jim Jarmusch.
That’s a nice gang of mates.
You create a family, and this film, Father Mother Sister Brother, is almost an extension of that. Jim really creates an environment on set where everyone is working for him. He’s such a legend, so everyone strives to be at the top of their game. It’s quite intense but fun.
Jim Jarmusch, Catherine George, and Abel Ferrara
You spoke a bit about using the same red throughout that film. Blanchett’s character is interesting in that she has always has this blue shirt on as well. It suggests the character’s more buttoned-up interiority to me. Was that something you spoke about?
We spoke more about how not to overemphasize it. It was like a subtle thing, trying to have a pop of color, but not too much.
Working on a film like Snowpiercer, where everything is kind of emphasized, must be a different challenge. In the masterclass, you mentioned that Tilda’s outfit in that movie was inspired by a photo you saw of Muammar Gaddafi.
Minister Mason’s? Yeah, I found this picture that was so great. [Gaddafi] was on a plane going to Italy and he’d made himself this badge, and I was like, “That’s inspired!”
You mentioned in the talk about going to Tilda’s house in Scotland with Director Bong to work on the costumes. Did these huge glasses come from that meeting?
They were actually from the props department in Prague. But Tilda, she just loves to go for it, with the teeth, and the glasses.
She must be a dream to work with as a costume designer. Singular-looking, incredibly fashionable, but also seemingly very open to trying whatever?
Oh, incredible. That was part of the nervousness about meeting her. I came from fashion college and I actually had a sketch/collage book that I did at fashion school and there’s a page with Tilda in her early 20s.
From the Derek Jarman days?
Yes! I showed her that much later, and she was like, “Oh my God, where did you find that?” So I think I went into it worrying that I wasn’t going to live up to a fashion editorial standard, but she has this dual life where she can be this fashion icon, but she’s also really involved in costume and character development.
She seems to have a very unique kind of energy.
She has an amazing way of being in the world, a connection. I think because she’s Scottish, Belfast has a deep connection with Scotland, so we hit it off, you know?
Catherine George and Bong Joon Ho on set
Did you have some nights out together with Bong in Scotland?
Not in Scotland, but while shooting in Prague. His apartment was opposite the Irish pub, so we had a lot of work meetings there. He fell in love with their stew and the Guinness.
During the talk, you spoke about these moments in a fitting when a piece of clothing goes on and it’s a kind of eureka thing, where everyone just feels it. Did you have this at any point with Pattinson during the production of Mickey 17?
Well, yes, when we tried the thermal suit on Robert, but the tricky part about Mickey was designing the Earth look. When they’re in space, it could kind of be whatever. The book is set thousands of years in the future, so I struggled to think what that would be. Director Bong didn’t want the austere, clean, very minimalist environment that people use in space a lot; he wanted it to feel lived-in. I looked at Alien and the crew a lot, which is always an inspiration. The photographs of Sigourney Weaver and John Hurt.
Harry Dean Stanton in the cap and—
—and the Hawaiian shirt! It’s iconic. We actually used a Hawaiian-type shirt on Steven Yeun. We designed the fabric as a sort of topographical map. Inspired by his job as a pilot. Steven is incredible. We’d worked together on Okja.
He always has this little note of danger about him, especially in Bong’s films. You mentioned the first time you met Bong during the masterclass. How did you end up reconnecting with Jarmusch on Paterson?
It was funny, because after working on Coffee and Cigarettes I had to remind him, and he was like, “Yeah, of course, I remember you.” I think when I got a call for that, it was some combination of Tilda and something he’d seen that I’d worked on. Do you know the dog in Paterson?
Yeah, he’s a kind of French bulldog?
Yes, but in the script it was just a dog. And my dog Randy usually comes with me. So I was pitching my dog more than myself. He didn’t get the part, but he was an inspiration to director Bong for the eyes of the super pig in Okja.
Wow, very kind eyes. They’re kind of a key part of that movie.
Exactly.
With some actors, do you find they bring their own style into it? You talked a bit about the process of making Spaceman with Adam Sandler. I remember watching that movie and noticing that Sandler was wearing the kind of basketball shorts that you always associate with him. Was that a choice?
No, actually we had tried to avoid that. But then we thought, “You know what? That’s the best thing for the character.”
It’s funny with Sandler. He’s kind of a bit of a style guy these days, in his own way.
He‘s become a style icon. Even though he tries so hard not to be.
I guess that’s the whole appeal.
He was great fun to work with. We shot in Prague just after the last lockdown there. It was lovely to be there with less people around , but especially for him to be able to walk around a city that’s usually packed with tourists.
Are there any recent films that you‘ve been particularly inspired by?
I’m sort of delving into a new movie world for my new project.
This is for Ti West’s Christmas Carol, right? Is he going for that classic Dickensian approach?
Somewhat, but a dark retelling, so I’ve been looking at period movies. I came across an actor, Conrad Veidt, and some German expressionist films. The Man Who Laughs, and Dr. Caligari. Finding those images have been foundational.
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